Stewart Lee Udall served as Secretary of the Interior under Presidents Kennedy and Johnson, at a time of sea changes in the way the country thought about land and resource management, and when many of the nation's most important federal environmental laws were passed. James G. Watt served as Secretary of the Interior under President Reagan, during an era when federal control of anything was seen as bad. The two former Secretaries could not seem more different - and yet they sat down together last night in Boulder to discuss their careers, land management, the West, and the environment, and they even agreed on a thing or two.

Udall, considered by many one of the greatest living heroes of conservation, is still amazingly lucid in his mid-80s. He spouted off on global warming, the evils of the interstate highway system, and the need for presidential leadership on the environment. Watt, who managed to charm the predominantly leftie audience despite being a conservative born-again Christian, expounded on the need for serious efforts to explore renewable energy sources (including nuclear power), the absurdity of trying to sell off large chunks of federal land (as a recent Bush administration proposal would), and the evils of special interest influence on environmental politics (by which I assume he meant both environmentalists and industry groups, though he didn't specify).

They found common ground to some degree: that we have reached the end of the era of cheap oil, that the National Parks are seriously underfunded, and that we have not done enough for Native Americans. But where they most disagreed was on the subject of global warming. Udall, who called the current administration "anti-science," expressed deep concern over global warming and called for fundamental changes to American society, including urban planning and transportation. "We're going in the wrong direction," he said.

Watt, for his part, said he had no opinion on global warming and wasn't ashamed to admit it. "I have never bothered to focus on global warming," he said. "It doesn't interest me and frankly there's nothing I can do about it." He said he planned to drive his car "until there's no oil left."

The event was sponsored by the Center of the American West, a prominent organization housed at the University of Colorado that has brought all the living former Interior Secretaries to speak in Boulder.

Photo credit: National Park Service