Tuesday October 14th, 2008
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Talking Turkey with the Bacon Eater
Posted by Belinda Miller on July 25, 2007 - 8:19am.
I guess it’s the zeitgeist.Georgia had a sudden and unexpected bout of human carnivorous guilt. As she cheerfully chewed her turkey and whole grain toast, her mood turned pensive. She munched and thought, munched and thought, and then said, “It’s kind of sad that this is a dead turkey.”
I always feel like if I just had a few minutes to think I could come up with something so brilliant and thoughtful to say to her. But of course, in real life, these things happen as we are rushing to finish lunch, get G dressed and get out of the door to meet Baxter and his mom at the Children’s Museum.
So I asked Georgia, in my best mom-as-therapist voice, “How does that make you feel?”
“I feel sorry for the turkey who died,” she said. And then, gloomily, “The other turkeys in its family must miss it.”
She’s had to deal with a lot of death in her little life, and it may be more about families than animals, so I wanted to let her have her mourning. But I also felt like I should explain to her why we eat meat, but I don’t have a great explanation. Hova and I were vegetarian for several years, when we didn’t know our B12 from our bean burrito. It’s hard now to remember what spurred us on, or how we made the decision. It was political, surely, trying to eat for a Small Planet. It was about animals, definitely, about health marginally, and probably most about being very poor and living in New York, where the best deals were veggie. We just became vegetarians, and then years later, stopped being vegetarians, though we are much more conscientious omnivores.
I was empathetic to Georgia’s concern: “You’re right, it is sad to think that an animal gave its life so we could eat it. We should honor that turkey’s life and thank it.”
We did a tiny thank-you ceremony as we dumped the remaining pieces of turkey into the cats’ bowl. I knew that it wasn’t enough — she was really getting sad. And if she said she didn’t want to eat meat, I’d let her make that decision, even now at three-and-five-sixths. So, as we shimmied her into her spinny dress and got her cleaned up and ready to go, I tried:
“A lot of people don’t eat meat, because it makes them too sad, just like you. We eat meat because we think that people are made to eat a little of everything. We don’t eat it very often, but when we do we enjoy it. We also feel like if we are going to eat meat, we have to make sure the animal was cared for during its lifetime, so we only buy meat from farmers who treat their animals nicely.”
She seemed to appreciate that, though I could see the thoughts were still running around in her small, but intense mind. So I asked, “Do you want to stop eating bacon?”
It was kind of a cruel trick. When she was two we were at a French festival where they had a whole roast pig. She had seen it and I thought she’d be freaked out, so I explained that the pig was dead, and people eat the meat from the dead pig. And she merrily quipped in her baby voice, “I want EAT pig!” So I was the one with the qualms, and pork is definitely her weakness.
But to her credit, she did give the bacon question some thought before she said, “No… I like bacon. Isn’t it funny how we say bacon instead of pig?”
“Yeah, and we say steak instead of cow,” I said. “I guess that’s because people don’t want to think about the animals. But I think we should remember where our food came from.”
“Yes, me too. Can we say thank you to all the animals we eat?”
Now that will definitely put me off my pulled pork! But I suspect the day will come when Georgia decides she can’t deprive the animal families of their loved ones. And that will be okay. We’ve done it before, and she can experiment with her budding principles. But if she dallies in condimentarianism, I’ll rein her in.
Topics:
- Live the Change
- Growing Greener Kids
- parenting
- small scale farming
- The Green-Eyed Momster
- vegeterianism
One of my big objections to parents "teaching" their children about food, especially about vegetarianism, is this concept of guilt. In the last 30 years or so, our culture has personified animals, according to them the same thoughts, feelings and motivations that we humans have. This is absolutely not so; and to allow a child to worry over the "family" of an animal raised for meat is, in my opinion, detrimental and abusive to the child. Children should be taught the truth about our need to eat animals for the proteins and other nutrients our bodies receive from them. People who choose not to eat meat should focus on other reasons for doing so, rather than claiming to spare the animals' families, or that there is no humane way to raise or butcher them.
I have raised eleven children over the past 30 years; we have run the gamut from SAD (Standard American Diet), to vegan and raw and now are comfortable with the choices we've made for health and spiritual reasons. We raise our own chickens, eggs, and some meat. There are lambs in our yard now; and our youngest children at home understand, and will continue to learn, that they are for us to eat, providing us with as pure a meat source as we can obtain, just like the grass fed meat we purchase from other growers. My adult children have gone on to make their own choices about their life-and-eating styles, not at all traumatized over raising animals to eat, and clearly understanding the choices they have before them.
I would hope that all parents will think ahead and calmly learn and discover how to answer these kinds of questions, without adding unneccessary emotionalism and partial truths. In my experience, an honest answer at 5 helps them trust you and keep talking at 12 and 20; do your homework and conquer your own fears, parents, so you can truly teach your children and prepare them for life.
I agree with loryjean, but the verifiable truth is that many of our food animals are cruelly mistreated by the industry before they die. Perhaps we should all know that so we can stop it, but maybe not for children of a young age.
I am vegetarian because of health issues, but until three years ago, I ate meat of all kinds. When I switch to a vegetarian diet, I did not think about how animals were slaughtered. My grandfather kept chickens and rabbits, and I helped him many times "dress" them for dinner. Even I for a short time raised rabbits for food. I thought nothing of the "dressing" part because I knew it was very quick and that my animals were not treated cruelly. (My grandfather was very gentle, too.)
But after I started my vegetarian diet, I visited vegetarian websites where I leaned about the cruelty, and it is reprehensible. It needs to be stopped. Slaughtering animals for food is what humans have done forever, but we don't need to be cruel.
Your point is excellent about dispelling ideas that anthropomorphize animals (except my cat, but that's another story). But I do believe we need to stop the cruelty.
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Although I don't eat meat I do so for health reasons not because of the feelings of the animal I would be eating. I do agree that the industry is cruel and inhumane to animals that are to be slaughtered. We do need to do something about it, what is the question? How about more government subsidies for more humane treatment of feed animals? Anyone know how to start a grassroots movement?
Well, it’s a very personal thing, and those who do feel strongly that we are equals to other animals are entitled to their empathy and opinion. But I agree that we were “made” to eat meat, and anything else we could get our Neanderthal mitts on — I think humans might have been more scavenger than hunter. But we were also “made” to die young and be constantly pregnant, so I’m not sure how much of a role evolution should play in our current choices. For me, it’s important to let Georgia explore her feelings without me always telling her what’s “right.” I mean, I tell her the rules, and why there are rules, and let her know the differing opinions, but I want her to know that there are many ways to think. I foster her being empathetic to animals and bugs and plants because I want her to value nature and the planet as a whole. And she’s beginning to understand that her choices affect other creatures and the earth. Getting through the cuddly bunny family stage is a part of it, I think!
About what we can do to stop the cruelty of facotry farms? Stop buying meat from supermarkets that buy from factory farms (most chains, cartainly the huge box stores), and know where your meat comes from. You will pay a premium for this, but that is how it works. Once the voting with dollars makes sense to the Big Guns you'll start seeing humanely raised beef at WalMart.
Wow all seem to hear in this blog is all the negativity, what is up with that? I don’t like it, you all sound like my dad. As most of you know I am taking a 30 day Meat Free Challenge, I am doing it for myself health wise and for animal cruelty also. My dad thinks it is a stupid idea, he said the same thing all of you are saying: “We were BORN to eat meat”. How can all of you people be so insensitive? And how can I or anyone ever get support in what we are trying to do with our lives with all this negativity? To improve our world and ourselves we need support to hold us up not people pushing us down all the time! Maybe I am getting a little mad because of lack of support I am not getting at home or from friends, or maybe it’s just the lack of meat huh? You know us “predators” can go a little crazy when we don’t get our meat….
Well, I didn't think I was being negative; just pointing out some very real issues that surround teaching our children and eating...one of the reasons that we do raise our own or purchase from local growers (not just meat but everything!) is that we don't want to support the factory farms. Ten minutes on the internet will cure you for life of that! I am all for choices, but I have realized that there have to be ethics and boundaries. Saying that people can do whatever they want is detrimental to our society as a whole. I don't believe in legislating ethics, but there must be a common moral standard...isn't the lack of that part of the reason that we have factory farms and dishonest production? As adults, we have to take responsibility for the world we inhabit, and do our best to teach and effect the changes that ethics and humanity call for.
I appreciate all that has been said on this subject so far; exchanging our ideas and beliefs can benefit everyone.
Yes I do know that I do not support factory farms either. I live in a FARM and FACTORY built city, trust me I know what it does. I hate it, the rural country and everybody here is subduing to horrible factory work. The Homeless rate is SKY high, it’s depressing, but only inspires me in what more we could do. All I am saying is that I KNOW our world and everything could possibly be better IF we make a change. It doesn’t mean you have to be Vegetarian or a Global Warming Activist or even if you recycle everyday , but just as a human being, for our civilization.
I think it is good to that we are expressing ourselves everyone should get their voice heard even if it is on a website!
What I do think is those of us who do eat some kind of animal, be it pig, cow, chicken, turkey, or fish, give thanks like the Indians did. I think we do this to some extent when we say Grace before our meals but how many people thank the animal who gave it's life so we can live ours? Seems like Georgia is already on board with this one....
When I was younger my family and I when we were all together we would always say grace before each meal. Wow, now I kind of don’t feel that bad about eating meat all those years, I said grace. I am still thankfull.
I'm not really sure that you should make your child a vegetarian, but I have to say that I am one. I do eat meat sometimes, but I am mostly vegetarian.
I don't think a young child should be vegetarian. If they want to then fine, but I think we should give them a choice.
I have to say that I do feel sorry for animals that give up their life so we can eat it, even if it does taste good.
not_bob18